Get a job, dummy
It’s quite a sight: the bluefish round up huge schools of bunker and rip into them, slashing, biting and leaping out of the water in their enthusiasm for the chase. Well something like that happens in the real estate world of Greenwich beginning next week and continuing for a couple of more. Yes, it’s that time of year when private school admissions are announced and unleash a wave of parents into town.
Has precious been rejected by that famous NYC institution, Miss Smarties’ Nursery Skool for Children of the Rich and Undeserving? Time to leave the city and head for the Greenwich private school system, assuming, you careless parent you, that you have also applied to them and made generous and frequent contributions to their building fund. No? You, my friend, are SOL.
Bunkie has been deemed unfit for admission to the best NYC schools and by Brunswick, Country Day and Greenwich Academy? Well, you are a failure and you’d better start looking in another town with more “flexible” standards. I understand that Green Hills Farms, up in Westport, has the occasional spot for heretofore unspotted geniuses. But can you live in Greenwich and withstand the contempt of your neighbors when the Greens Farms bus pulls up outside your mansion? Probably not so it’s Westport for you, sucker (you can probably get away with the ignominy equally well in New Canaan and Darien because they don’t have any schools of note).
Okay, it may not be quite as bad as I describe it, but private school admissions do influence the decisions of many parents about whether to move to Greenwich, and, depending on what arrives in the mail next week, we should see a flurry of new buyers. Or that’s been the pattern in the past; we’re counting on it again.
Hey CF, there are quite a few kids in Greenwich who go to St. Luke’s in New Canaan. And a bus picks them up too!
But the bus is disguised with a big “Kountry Daze” paint job.
Speaking of schools…check out the amazing accomplishments of this fellow; Connor Harris. A Greenwich High School kid; doing well.
http://www.greenwichtime.com/default/article/Greenwich-High-senior-wins-AP-award-3353713.php
Actually about half of matriculation for the incoming class is legacy (siblings of kids already enrolled) or facuty’s kids so the net buying impact on the market is probably minimal
Since I’m not 8 years old and can’t opine on the matter as one who actually ATTENDS these private schools, but doesn’t this private school frenzy otherwise have everything to do with insecure or insane parents and nothing to do with the kids themselves? Any of you have kids in these private schools? Do they see their kid neighbors who don’t go to the same private school and call them loser public school dorks? Or would they get their prissy ass kicked by those ruffian public school attendees? Would you, as private school parent, get your own prissy ass kicked anywhere outside the safety of your range rover and private yoga studio? Just curious….
Okay Chris, it is Friday afternoon in a market with lots of activities… where is the real estate news?
I keep hearing that everyone is very busy these days!
I was out of the office all nmorning showing houses and am going back out tomorrow, Sunday and morning. But reported sales? Nada.
Yeah, CC, I saw that but I’m always depressed reading about kids so much smarter than me, so I ignored it. Quite a young man.
Yeah CF, but you are not doing yourself any Real Estate favors if you dont at least share the occassional bits of good public school news around here. Hard to believe,based on this blog alone, but kids do manage to excel at GHS too.
We have two at a couple of the schools mentioned above
We aren’t rich by Greenwich standards, but are in the 1% (would have to think most Greenwich residents are?). We decided paying the tuition was a better use of our money vs buying a bigger house or fancier car or nicer vacation or even retiring a couple years earlier
The education is, at worst, marginally better and, depending on which school zoned for, can be far superior. It varies. But in our minds there is a much higher probability of reaching their full potential at the small private schools.
There are obviously kids that do poorly from the private schools and many who are wildly successful from the public system. I think for many who sacrifice to send their kids to privates it’s just really a matter of maximizing the chance of success.
Darien does not have the private schools that Greenwich has, probably because the public schools in Darien are so superior to those of Greenwich. Don’t take my word on the school measures, look it up yourself. You will find that Darien schools excels in most measures vs. Greenwich. Just sayin’.
Just_looking,
You can’t simply look at the avg test scores and compare homogeneous Darien with heterogeneous Greenwich. Dramatically different racial and socioeconomic profiles (to Greenwich’s detriment in test score).
The best comparison would be to look at the top 10% of each town and compare the two.
Pretty funny mental image.
Completely sane and rational position from Catch a Falling Knife.
Darien has 1/3rd the population of Greenwich. 20k vs 60k. Based on this difference alone its unlikely that Darien would have comparable private schools.
Then we have the other clear difference; Gwich has far more lower income households than Darien. If Gwich schools compared exactly to Darien’s then Gwich should receive national recognition for excellence considering the distinctly different demographics for approx 1/3 of the school system’s population.
Lastly, when you look close at the statewide exams, in many instances Gwich schools are performing very well, at say a 90 to 95% proficiency rate vs New Canaan or Darien at 95% to 97%. Basically, the distinction between schools is that in Gwich there is 1 more kid per class of 20 that is not performing as well as the avg in the surrounding towns.
Hey landlubber. the correct terminology is boil.
According to Wikipedia, “the term bluefish boil does not exist”.http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special%3ASearch&search=bluefish+boil&fulltext=1 You must be thinking of a fish boil, an activity involving square head cheese eates in the midwest and fresh water fish, presumably carp. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fish_boil
Last I checked Greens Farms Academy had –1) –much better financial stability then the fancy Greenwich schools you reference– Check out their balance sheets– lots of leverage used to build buikldings–the schools are run by hedge funders — and 2)– Greens Farms Academy has a better college placement record
I realize your comments are intended to be funny, but when it comes to five-year-old children I’d tone down the rhetoric. The whole private school admissions process in NYC is demoralizing enough. I know of several amazing families with lovely children who simply did not get a spot in private school. They were heartbroken not bc of their egos, but bc their local NYC public is atrocious — overcrowded, no gym, no library, no music teacher, parents who are high-school drop-outs. I know of others who were accepted to private school, but choked at the $40,000 tuition, especially when they have several children. Still others are exploring certain suburbs bc they were told that the publics are similar to privates — small classes, engaging teachers, a creative/rigorous curriculum, involved parents, strong music/art/sports. (True for Greenwich or just a myth?) In short, there is no cookie cutter reason parents with small children decide to look at houses Greenwich. (And the alleged “frenzy” should have already started, because letters went out 2 weeks ago.)
Ah, Anon2, you do realize that that post was written tongue in cheek, don’t you? If not, then it’s back to The Little Red School House for remedial reading!
Cos Cobber: have you not read that Riverside, Old Greenwich, No Mianus….have all dropped in student achievement—and they couldn’t be more homogenous? Something else is going on.
I believe what has parents running for the doors is that if your kid isn’t in the top 5-10% of the class, or conversely, the bottom ESL student—or a special needs student—then your kid is ignored.
As a country, we don’t address the vast middle. I think you can go to any public school and see high achievers, but is this sustainable for a country to have such a small percentage producing results.
I think not. And, i believe a lot of other parents feel likewise.
Oh, stop it!Laugh a little – it’s really not that important where Junior goes to school. What does seem to determine success is a good family life with parents involved in their child’s education.
@Georgie: “As a country, we don’t address the vast middle.” Ain’t that the truth.
It’s all about doing what you can to help your child succeed with the resources you have.
There are lots of parents at the privates who just throw money at everything in a suboptimal way hoping that it solves the problem. They are not involved in their children’s lives and the progeny often end up with development issues later in life. Their kids are born on third base and are led to think they hit a triple in the game of life.
Others’ children have no resources and no headstart and are zoned for schools that are not considered the greatest, but through determination and perseverance help their child to end up on second or third making the best of the public system and with values that help them to make the best of what they were given in life.
It’s pretty obvious which parent had the greater impact in the end, no matter what the ultimate result is.
However, many times success is determined not by what you know, but by who you know….so that network of friends from Brunswick whose parents are connected can get you connected and so on….
Luck and timing can also help success.
At last! Thank you Chris for cutting to the chase. People get so caught up with where little Johnny goes to school that they lose sight of the important fact of parenting being more important than schooling. If your child is at any school in Greenwich (public or private), he will do just fine if he has support, involvement and plain ol fashioned love from his folks. We’re talking about Greenwich here. The margins of difference in results between the schools is not that wide, and no gap is so wide that a little extra support at home won’t fill the breach.
As for the anonymous whinger from the City. If you don’t like the system in the City, it’s simple – move. But stop the whining. You’re worse than my 2 year old.
Darien loves to claim they have much better schools than Greenwich, but it’s an apples to oranges comparison. There are 11 Greenwich elementary schools alone and they vary in their rankings. Yes, Ham Ave and New Leb have major problems, but some of our schools are Great. Look at the current rankings of CT elementary schools. You know what’s one of the top 10 schools in the state? Riverside. You know what isn’t? Any school in Darien.
http://www.schooldigger.com/go/CT/schoolrank.aspx
The New Normal, Just_Looking:
Compare the figures on the Math CMTs for 2010-2011 school year, for grades 3-5. Students reach one of three levels (Proficient, Goal, Advanced) above a Basic level. Connecticut’s target level is Goal, because frankly Proficient really isn’t proficient, even though that is what is used to meet No Child Left Behind requirements.
Figures represent percentage of students in each school or district or group of districts reaching the performance level.
School Advanced Goal Proficient
Old Greenwich 49.1% 86.2% 97.6%
North Street 51.3 90.9 99.0
North Mianus 54.9 86.4 95.7
Riverside 61.3 92.5 98.4
Darien 49.5 89.3 97.0
All Greenwich 44.9 80.4 93.5
DRG A 55.8 89.6 97.5
DRG B 49.1 84.8 95.5
DRG A includes Darien, Easton, New Canaan, Redding, Ridgefield, Weston, Westport, and Wilton. DRG B includes districts similar to Greenwich from a demographic point of view.
Darien actually is a poor comparison, if you want to make the case that we are worse. They don’t even measure up to the average of the “wealthy” districts, and don’t even come close to Riverside. New Canaan has three of the top five schools in the state; Riverside is number nine. Other Greenwich elementary schools, as you would expect, fall well short of these figures.
Greenwich’s top scoring schools hold their own against the Darien’s but, as noted, Greenwich is a very diverse town, which many outsiders and some insiders don’t recognize. Two of our elementary schools have 60+% of their students receiving free or reduced price lunches. While some of our schools compare well, overall we are falling behind the progress being made by not only the wealthy districts, but also the comparable districts like West Hartford, Fairfield, Guilford, etc. Many other districts are making moves to improve their curriculum in order to improve the education provided to their children. We are sitting pat with a failing program (Everyday Math) while we lose ground.
Hope this helps frame the issue. For more information on how Greenwich students are doing, click on Bad Math In Greenwich Schools under USEFUL LINKS above.
hate to say it, but there’s a massive difference b/w private vs public
harvard vs boston college
manhattan vs nj
mercedes vs ford
goldman vs b of a
wachtell vs sherman
belle haven vs cos cob
choose one, get the others
So if I choose a Mercedes I get all the others? That surprises me but lots of things in this world surprise me. By the way, assuming that you yourself attended Harvard, lived in NYC, owned a Mercedes, worked at Goldnman, and were admitted to the Belle Haven Club, did you learn anything of value along the way? If so, you failed to mention it.
Unfortunately this is the way the world works
It is not ideal, but it is reality
I’m not questioning whether that’s how your world works but what if someone doesn’t value what you do? If love, friendship, compassion, happy children, a sense of the grace of the universe are valuable and a Mercedes depreciating in the driveway is not, then your entire list is completey and utterly irrelevant. Just saying.
One thing is for sure, anybody who went to Harvard, drives a Mercedes, works at Goldman and lives in Belle Haven is sure to be a supreme D-bag! I wouldn’t trade places with this hypothetical person for anything!
@anon 4.49 – who’s to say that the guy who went to harvard, drives a merc, worked at goldman and is liviing in luxury in belle haven is not happy?
happiness is a relative and personal standard.
who made you judge and jury?
Second prize is a set of steak knives.
Third prize is you’re fired
@ the new normal,
All your world accoutrements (including your world view) can not mask the fact that you are an empty suit.
Missed my point, Buckley, which is that happiness is indeed personal and that some people couldn’t care less about the trappings of “success” New World boasts of. If that’s how he defines his life it’s none of my business and I congratulate him on finding and obtaining those things that are important to him. He seemed to imply that his list was symbolic of and summarized a fulfilled life; it sounds hollow and incomplete to me, but I’m not living his life and he’s not living mine so ….
Does it bother New Normal that his leaders at Goldman didnt follow his script? How could it be….it wasnt suppose to work that way:
Llyod Blankfein / Goldman = public school / public housing
Gary Cohn / Goldman COO = slummed it at american univesity – no advanced degree
David Viniar / Goldman CFO = public school / union college for undergrad
by the way, would the New Normal have permitted
Hebert Wachtell to slum it at NYU law school before going on to build his powerhouse firm? Hebert, what about the script?!
The great thing about America is it is a meritorcricy. Cos Cobber’s data just proved that. Doesn’t matter about public or private. If you’ve got the ability, the work ethic and a pair of balls, that is all that counts. There is no script. But if New Normal’s road map makes him happy, then good for him. Let him enjoy his big house in Belle Haven. Most people would dream about living up there, but he’s achieved it, so all power to him.
But to CF’s point – New Normal’s way is not everyone’s route to happiness. There are people who finally make it into the BH Club, take a stroll onto the private beach and stretch out there all alone, surrounded by tranquility and beautiful scenery, and every luxury imaginable, but are empty inside and have sacrificed too much to get there.
The key is trying to acheive inner happiness in the here and now, without being envious of those around you………….
NYU is a top 10 (borderline top 5) law school!
It is always easy to want to try to quantify success and happiness, the latter being almost completely subjective asnthere are billions of happy ppl living on less than $1 a day
btw the last CEOs of Goldman:
Lloyd Blankfein Harvard ugrad and Harvard Law School
Hank Paulson Harvard B-School
Jon Corzine UChicago B-School
Bob Rubin Harvard ugrad
Stephen Friedman Columbia Law School
John Weinberg Princeton and HBS
John Whitehead HBS
there is a pretty strong correlation here
New Normal of 4:18, you’re Mercedes vs Ford world model is a little shallow, and if you’d carried your observations out just a little further, you’d have a completely different view. Many of the weatlhiest of the wealthy have a strong aversion to drawing attention to themselves and drive beaters. Old, beat-up Fords, Chevys and Beamers. I won’t name names, but I know this for a fact. I have a thing for old beat up Beamers for which I never pay more than a thousand bucks. At the other end of the spectrum are all the pretenders whose shiny new Beamers and Mecedes are probably costing them each month a little more than they can afford. Perhaps some of the new wealth is a little more brash, but if they keep their money long enough, they’ll learn.
@ Rude Poster
- why so angry and envious all the time. I’ve looked back at all your posts and there is so much bitterness there? Maybe it’s not New Normal who wears the empty suit, so much as you who wears the empty soul……….
What’s fun about bluefishing is that you don’t just sit there all day fishing, you cruise all day looking for birds working the surface, trying to figure out where they’ll break out next. The video doesn’t do justice to what it’s like to be in the middle of a feeding frenzied school: there are tons of 36 inch long plus, eighteen to twenty pound fish, many jumping feet out of the water, and that will hit anything that moves. Sorry girls, but the best part is clubbing the fish to death when you get them in the boat. My wife thought I was just making that part up ’till she heard someone else’s husband describing the thrill of the sport down at the dock.
Do they let Goldman d-bags into the Greenwich clubs or do those guys hang out in Westport (or New Jersey)?
Couldn’t resist commenting on this thread. I am 0.01 percent, have multiple advanced degrees (including Ivy league) and earn a living in the financial field. I worked very hard to get here, but luck amplified the outcome.
I don’t drive a Mercedes and I live in a nondescript Riverside house (by Riverside standards). I work around the house as much as possible (cook, clean, yardwork) and hope my kids benefit from their parents’ involvement and setting (hopefully) the right examples.
I lament the herculean douchebags that surround me in Greenwich. It is easy to lose sight of the decent folks, of which there are a handful, thank goodness. I wish there were more.
And no, the money doesn’t do much for happiness at the core…
But poverty can be really miserable and not so easy to get out of as some may think.
Dude –
So you actually have two pretty good discussion threads going on at once. This one and the wasabi/Slum thread. Pretty good for you!! You taking new vitamins or something?
Personally, I have no interest in a discussion thread as to where the Tiger Mom’s of Greenwich feel they need to send their precious little crotch fruit. But Tiger Mom implies Asian, right? We need a better name for Greenwich Tiger Mom’s, don’t we? Hmmmm….Married Well Mom’s? New Money Mommies? Let me ponder this some more.
Anyhows, what I find interesting is how many or your Reader(s) are philosophers!! Who woulda thunk?
This little gem really caught my eye: “The key is trying to acheive inner happiness in the here and now, without being envious of those around you………….”
THAT is truly a GREAT DEEP ORIGINAL THOUGHT!! NOT!!!!
This “philosopher” must live in La La Land. Certainly not Greenwich. We are all about envy and greed. It’s what we do best!!
But actually I am really not envious of anyone. I worked hard for my money, and have a boat load of it!! Doesn’t suck to be me Dude!!
But I started to think there is one thing I am missing? STEPH!! Why is that Dude, he looks like Buddy Hackett, so I don’t lose on looks. And while he looks like Buddy, he CAN’T be as funny. So I don’t lose there. He is a short little weasel, and I am tall so, I am pretty sure I out package size him. In fact I know it!!
$o what i$ it that I am not $eeing? It $eems to me it $hould be obviou$. $hare $ome common $en$e thought$ with me Dude.
Your Pal,
Walt
What a nice post Silent minority…..you sound like a great person and father….someone from another era with modesty, humility, and reserve rather than today’s era of flash and trash.
Wow. I’ve never lived on the East Coast. Just among the Great Unwashed in flyover midwest.
And I like it.
You can purchase a beautiful home for $500K-$600K, send your kids to pretty good schools, live a block or two to a lake (or even on lakeshore of the more modest ones) and have mostly well educated and pleasant neighbors.
A few years ago, I was working with a young couple from the New York area. They simply Could Not Believe that you could find a lovely home in a good area that was no more than a 20-30 minute drive to downtown. They told me that although they did live in a cultural mecca – they rarely were able to take advantage of it. Between the incredibly long commute from work and home, juggling babysitters, etc. – they just never did it.
Perhaps I’m missing something incredible by not living in New York. And then again – perhaps it’s many of you who are the ones missing something….
@AJ, look up Asian Carp videos on YouTube one day when you’re bored.
@ Empty rude poster.
Clearly, your device has run out of batteries and you are in low spirits. Get well soon!
Are you sure St. Luke’s in New Canaan is not noteworthy? Are Brunswick, Masters (not that far from Greenwich) really better than SLS? On what do base your appraisal?