Good: this is where the progressives get their news, so maybe …

Jon Stewart accuses Sebelius of lying about the ObamaKare exemption given to employers. You may remember that exemption, the one where Obama waved the royal wand and changed “the settled law of the land”, the “health plan voted in by the majority” that droolers like Francis Fudrucker have been spluttering about, by creating an exemption for businesses (and unions) where none had existed. This has upset Mr. Stewart, if not see-no-evil-apologists like Francis.

During his interview with Sebelius, Stewart repeatedly sought an answer from the secretary on why big businesses got a delay in their Obamacare mandate to provide affordable health insurance to their employees, while individuals did not get a delay in their Obamacare mandate making them purchase health care or face a penalty.

In a rare monologue at the end of the show, Stewart said he remained confused and that he suspected that the secretary may have been lying to him.

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2013/10/08/jon-stewart-accuses-kathleen-sebelius-of-lying-to-him-about-obamacare/#ixzz2h86WI15s

60 Comments

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60 responses to “Good: this is where the progressives get their news, so maybe …

  1. Walt

    Dude –
    Good for John Stewart.
    This is just clearly partisan favoritism. The Liar in Chief has given a pass to unions on this, and other political cronies that got him elected. Again, this Administration will do and say what ever it takes – using the IRS against it’s enemies, cover up the murder of US Citizens in Benghazi, and try and stifle free speech, to move their commie progressive agenda forward.
    Here is Barry campaigning in 2008, calling it “unpatriotic” to raise the debt ceiling, when the debt was “only” $9.0 TRILLION!! He has run it up to $17 TRILLION and now he wants more.

    Comment Francis? Comment?
    Your Pal,
    Walt

    • Cos Cobber

      So yet again its okay for the white house to selectively amend and enforce legislation without any input from the legislative process.

      This is exactly how the second and third world operates.

      • Cos Cobber

        No comment yet FF on the special exemption granted by the WH? Why didn’t Obama take his exception to congress for approval? How is this not selective enforcement of the highest order?

    • FF

      As usual, Chris, you depend upon the echo chamber of the Daily Caller without actually looking at the interview. Why do you have to mislead to prove a false point. Your false point is that Jon Stewart attacked Sebelius because he is in favor of a delay in Obamacare. In fact, he is one of the many people your side likes to say is against Obamacare as if it matched up with your opinion. His opinion is that they should have been more aggressive in implementing Obamacare, not that they were not aggressive enough. His opinion, as clearly stated by Stewart, is that the plan is not LIBERAL enough, and, according to Stewart, we need a single payer plan. The Daily Caller is also flatly lying about the last monologue part. This is why ultimately the ideas of your ilk fail, because they have no real foundation in reality, just supported upon a tissue of conjecture and preordained conclusions without fact based support, just blind and misguided faith. Except you are impressing or converting nobody, because unless they have a seat in the Tea Party pews, they aren’t coming in to worship and THAT’s what gets you guys the most

      • No, Frankie, the point is that you people have been pounding your (puny) chests, shrieking that the evil Tea Party is subverting “the law of the land”, when in fact Obama starting do that immediately upon passage of his dream bill by first, exempting those unions powerful enough to command such royal favoritism and then postponing the mandate for employers. This, as has been repeatedly pointed out here and elsewhere, was done by executive, extra-judicial fiat: the Tea Party is attempting to accomplish the same thing by lawful exercise of Congress’s power to enact, and amend legislation.
        You refuse to acknowledge that – I wonder why.

        • FF

          This line from the new book about the Romney campaign succinctly portrays the modern Republican view of the world

          “Of course, there was no reason for the Romney campaign to say publicly that it was losing. Losing campaigns always put on a brave face. But after losing, the surprise and dismay within the Romney campaign seemed to stem less a failure of its own polls and more from a failure to let those polls take precedence over instinct and subjective judgment.”

          In other words, you guys subsist on self-referential delusion and faith, and confuse it with reality and facts

    • FF

      You too failed to watch the show, Walt, and instead relied upon the Daily Caller like a liberal relies upon the New York Times, that is unequivocally, unquestioned and with a puffed chest of righteousness. Amen, brother, good for Stewart. I suppose you too support a single payer as he so specifically said? Oh, he said that…..well let me find another out-of-context snippet to support without actually recognizing what was said. as far as the debt ceiling, could you review the US Constitution, Article I, Sections 7 and 8.
      And really, Benghazi? Really? C’mon. Its like a pleasant blankie to you, not for the sad loss of life but the thrilling excitement that comes with feeling that you “got him”, that evil Barry. So odd, so odd

      • Inagua

        FF – You forgot to respond to the video Walt posted of candidate Obama railing against the debt. If you object to an out of context snippet, here is an entry from the Congressional Record when Obama was a Senator:

        “The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure.”

        “If Washington were serious about honest tax relief in this country, we would see an effort to reduce our national debt by returning to responsible fiscal policies.”

        “Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grand children. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better. I therefore intend to oppose the effort to increase America’s debt limit.”

        FF, would you also share with us how Obamacare is impacting your personal health insurance situation, if at all?

        Disclosure: I had no health insurance from age 32 to 65. I was self-pay. I got Medicare at 65, and I love it. But my cardiologist didn’t. He just retired at 61 after his income dropped in half because of Medicare.

        • FF

          I receive my health benefits through my business, as do all employees of my business. We pay 100% of cost after a predetermined review period. The “gold” Obamacare plan is near to the benefits we pay, but has a higher deductible, so I would in theory get a somewhat lesser plan. However, I like my plan and my doctor so I’m gonna keep it even though the exchange – as I saw it – would result in an approximately $1000 savings per month (for the slightly lesser plan, same company)
          As far as the debt limit thing, Obama spoke in campaign mode, no doubt jumping on a moment in time. Should he have said it, no. Do politicians say stupid things, yes. Do I personally think this debt level is unsustainable, no. Do people running for President say things that they have no idea about until they are elected, yes. Though I would not by extension then decide that everything they said before and after was invalid because of one uninformed comment in 2007. If so, then you have to embrace anarchy. Or, you could hold them to account in an election, an election that Obama won rather handily in 2012

        • Inagua

          FF – Thanks. Yu are very lucky. Most small businesses I have read about have had substantial premium increases, post Obamacare.

          I am glad you are concerned about the debt. You do realize that if your Party’s spending goals are achieved that either the debt will continue to increase or the government will need more tax revenue, right? What tax changes do you suggest to get the needed revenue?

        • Shoeless

          FF, I’m only in finance, so I probably don’t have the right perspective on debt, unlike our politicians, but could you please enlighten me as to how our current deficit is sustainable?

          The answer is not that we’ve had deficits under republicans as well (a pox on both their houses). But please enlighten me as to how a debt that is equal to our entire economic output doesn’t concern you. In the 1950’s a dollar of gov’t debt produced 85cents of GDP, now it produces 18 cents. You see the pattern? It doesn’t get better, it gets to be a smaller impact every year. So, how exactly, do we whistle past the graveyard in perpetuity?

        • Anonymous

          I love it when someone excuses a prior statement as being in “campaign mode.” Is there a lamer explanation for someone having such little integrity. Upon what statements, then, should we ever trust this president given that he seems always to be in “campaign mode?”

        • Inagua

          Chris – Obama wants to plant a new Magic Money Tree. It is called the Financial Transaction Tax. It would generate substantial new revenue. I believe that Obama wants the shutdown/default crisis so he blame the hapless Republicans, elect a Democratic House, and pass a Financial Transaction Tax. Of course, he can’t admit it until after the election, but the way to really transform America is to glom onto a whole new revenue stream.

      • FF

        Well, people, lots of complaints but all ad hominem, so I will try to answer your problematic concerns. First, I do believe that we should increase taxes, although I am generally in favor of use taxes over straight income taxes. I think the gas tax is a strong place to raise revenue for infrastructure repair, and a substantial increase in that tax should be considered for repair of roads, introduction of new rail corridors, and all kinds of fixes for our failing roads. Consider the cost of the Metro North blowout to you personally, and consider the value of paying for it as you go. Until you can give me something not from your fairy godfather or from your Reagan Fantasy Comics series about how to pay for repairs that generate revenue indirectly, or avoid costly repairs on failed bridges that result in unforeseen costs that put stresses on budgets that require tax increases that make you scream, then you aren’t serious at all. Same as Obamacare. You talk about the death of America but you never, ever, EVER address the issue, unless you drool over tort reform, which is the height of stupid unseriousness as if that one item is the magic bullet for your ability to not address reality ever. And the sorry part is that you think you are the serious ones when you are just living in a big unformed theory instead of the real world.
        And Shoeless, the US debt to GDP ratio is about identical to every country in the developing world, all the EU countries including Germany, emerging countries such as Brazil, and Canada, japan and so on. Most of your third world countries in Africa and Asia have low ratios. the only real exceptions are Australia, which is fairly unique as an economy, and China, which is a moderate command economy. So if you’re shrieking, then the entire world is coming down with us – and I seriously doubt that is happening.
        And the fantasy tax that can only be passed by the Republican Congress (good luck on that, but read your constitution), so that big scary Obama dictator will probably be thwarted by “law”, the thing that many of you know as the Affordable Care Act.
        Can anyone here, ANYONE, make some sense instead of spout ideology. I said it before and I say it again, I feel like I’m in one of those 1980’s pro-Sandinista rallies where you cannot believe for one second that these otherwise intelligent people spout this nonsense.

        • Just for a start, Francis, you might stop using the dedicated gas tax revenue for general redistribution purposes.

        • Shoeless

          Japan is at 225%. Spain, Italy France are at 135%. They used to be at 100% just as we are now. There is only one direction this goes if it is not reined in. And the “everybody else does it” excuse is something I would expect from my six year old.

        • Inagua

          “..I am generally in favor of use taxes over straight income taxes.”

          FF — Use taxes will never bring in much of the needed revenue. How do you feel about consumption taxes? All of Europe has a VAT. Why don’t we? I believe that Obama has picked this shutdown/default fight because he wants to crush the Republicans and get the House back in 2014. And if he gets a Democratic House, he will push for and get a VAT. A VAT, in addition to Obamacare, would make Obama the most transformative president in US history, surpassing even FDR. FF, your side might be on the cusp of a truly historic victory. Obama might just turn America into a full-blown Welfare State.

    • Walt

      Francis –
      You blind, ignorant little weasel. Of course I “failed to watch the show”. It is progressive propaganda under the guise of humor. Although Stewart is very talented and very funny. And fourthly, I didn’t even read the Daily Caller, you puffed up progressive slob. I already know, from the LIAR in Chief’s LAP DOG MSM that Obama is handing reprieves to Obamacare to his political cronies left and right. THAT IS AN UNDISPUTED FACT YOU IGNORANT SLUG. So I congratulated Stewart for calling her on that, and I trusted the Dude got that right. I know, that is a stretch on my part, but that is what I did.

      And Benghazi. This is where you really piss me off, you callous, uncaring dingleberry, putting party protection at all costs REGARDLESS OF THE TRUTH. Just like Pantsuits “What difference does it make” comment. FOUR PEOPLE ARE DEAD. We were LIED TO by our President, Secretary of State and that other black chick who got promoted and whose name I don’t remember. Susan Beans?

      For you NOT to care about that, to accept that the highest officials in our Government find it TOTALLY ACCEPTABLE to lie, to not be held accountable to the people THEY ARE MEANT TO REPRESENT, makes you no better than an amoeba. A single cell organism with no spine. They have become so untouchable they DON’T EVEN CARE the lies are ridiculous. An OBVIOUS terrorist attack due to some schlock video? They should be taken for task for such a SHITTY INSULTING COVERUP!!

      And we didn’t “get him” which is the problem. And for what he did, yes, he should be “got”. It’s an American tragedy, which you obviously think is fine. For all your progressive liberal rants, you could care less about human life. Part of the cost of moving the progressive agenda forward? So no big deal, right? Let’s just move on.

      You make me want to barf. You obviously believe, like our Liar in Chief, that honesty, morals, ethics and accountability have no place in politics.

      Son, we live in a world that has values, and those values have to be protected by men with character and morals. Who’s gonna do it? You? You, FRANCIS? You have the luxury of not knowing what I know. And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, saves lives. You don’t want the truth because deep down in places you don’t talk about at parties, you want me on that here, you NEED me here. We use words like honor, code, loyalty. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom that Ronald Reagan provided, and then questions the manner in which he provided it. I would rather you just said thank you, and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you get a lobotomy, and take an ethics course. Either way, I don’t give a DAMN what you think!! A FEW GOOD MEN DUDE!! JACK!!!
      I pity you Francis.
      Walt

  2. Anonymous

    Guess how many of Kathleen Sebelius’ 3 Obamacare success stories have actually enrolled?

    http://twitchy.com/2013/10/07/guess-how-many-of-kathleen-sebelius-3-obamacare-success-stories-have-actually-enrolled/

    • Inagua

      Sebelius has found two people who enrolled. The first works two part time jobs and will pay $70 a month after the subsidy. The second has high blood pressure and currently pays over $7,000 a year for a COBRA policy. Obamacare will cost $6,000 less. No mention of subsidy, but I suspect that was just poor reporting.

      • Anonymous

        Two!!!!!

        • Inagua

          There will be many more and substantially all of them will be getting subsidies in one form or another. The young and healthy, who are supposed to pay for these “free riders” will largely pay the fine instead.

          I believe that Obamacare was designed to fail, as no reasonably intelligent person could ever think this model is viable. But getting a government operated system up and running was the paramount goal of the Left. It is but the first step to single payer, aka Medicare for all, with only the very wealthiest being able to afford private insurance or self-pay.Obamacare might be the worst law ever enacted in America. It will lead to lower quality of medical care and a reduced standard of living for ordinary people.

  3. Anonymous

    This seems to me to be the most obvious way to make an impression on the “low information voters” – how can the ACA “law” be sacrosanct when our Leader can get away with disregarding parts of the legislation he crammed down our collective throats to benefit his political allies? Exemption by executive fiat seems to invalidate the integrity of the entire legislation. ardrey18@optonline.netlaw.

    • Anonymous

      True, it’s illegal and un-Constitutional, but that has never stopped the thugs and brown shirts of the current Administration.

      The ignorant uninformed low information professional welfare voter and the deluded progressive do-gooder who mistakes coercing other people’s money for their causes as charity are essential to the Obama coalition.

    • FF

      Why do you keep on with this nonsense about not admitting the ACA is a law. Why the quotes, why the obsession with calling it a bill. I’m sure you saw that cartoon when you were a kid, right? When both houses of the Legislature vote affirmatively on the same language of a bill, it is sent to the President, and if he signs it, it is not called a “bill” anymore, but a law. And made up ideas from your own head do not invalidate that process

      • And your response to your leader amending that “law” by executive fiat? For that matter, his using that same,illegal power to amend our drug and immigration laws? I keep saying, you don’t care, but letting an executive get away with this will come back to haunt you when someone with an agenda you don’t like comes to power.

      • Yos

        Lawful? – a Tax Bill that originated in the Senate… attached as an amendment by Reconciliation to another Bill, by the Senate. Even by FF’s standards, both Houses did not in fact vote on the same language, so it fails. If Bush had pulled this off, F!F would (correctly) be screaming “Fascism!!!” and decrying the tyranny.

        Even KKK Byrd warned the process would undermine the Bill’s legitimacy.

        From spawning to hatching to foisting, this Bill has been a debauched offense and an embarrassment to the very concept of civilized democracy.

        Massive regulatory seizures of power were invented to provide “access” to some claimed desperately needy 30 millions… who, paradoxically enough, will still remain uninsured. But wait, there’s more! The Bill grants “preexisting condition” coverage to those who are young whilst creating an entire class of newly not-covered “preexisting condition” patients – the elderly. (Hey, Grandma! So how does Dr. O’s pain pill taste now, huh?)

        • FF

          Yos,

          Please take at least two Xanax. Or maybe get diagnosed for bipolar disorder because you went from a flat out lie that nobody seems to have ever said except you that both houses did not vote on a reconciled bill (FIRST TIME IN HISTORY!!!!), to taking a pleasing shot at Robert Byrd while at the same time feeling smugly confident that you had used him “against” the left, to repeating that it is a “bill” when it is in fact a law, to a little death panel action, finally concluding that the law will have no impact anyway. Why did you stop there? Why didn’t you then talk about the yellow pill that everybody will have to take that dulls the cortex and allows us only to say “I love the leader” and makes us all have gay weddings while toasting with contraceptives?
          I want my fiction entertaining. I give your novel one star

  4. TheWizard

    She should be excoriated for doing an interview with a comedian.
    Go on O’Reilly if she’s so sure of herself.

  5. shaker

    At a town hall meeting in New Hampshire on Aug. 11, 2009, President Barack Obama repeated a line he’s used many times in describing his health care proposal: “If you like your health care plan, you can keep your health care plan.”
    ….Letter from Aetna to my employees… ”

    ACA (the Affordable Care act) requires us to make significant changes to our health benefits plan designs. We cannot renew your employer’s existing plans in 2014. We are replacing our entire small employer portfolio with new health benefit plans that comply with the 2014 ACA requirements.”

    We will be getting a better, less expensive plan, no doubt…

  6. Peg

    FF – there is one and only one reason why ACA isn’t flourishing right now. It’s not the Republicans and it’s not the shutdown (ACA is funded irrespective of what happens with the shutdown).

    So – what is it? It’s the incredible, humongous, utterly complete incompetence of those who have designed it and are currently (attempting) to implement it.

    Oh, I know. They’ve “only” had over 3 years go work on it.

    So far, people can’t log on, can’t get help, can’t get signed up – and while this is going on, private information like social security numbers are being leaked erratically to random sources.

    I’m sure SOME HOW this is all GWB and the Republican’s fault. Still – I am actually hoping that ACA marches on – and everyone can see what a stupendous failure it really is.

    Maybe someone on the left should have read it before it became LAW.

    • FF

      Peg, this is the last grasp at straws. As you may likely know but are not willing to admit, states with exchanges (CT, New York, California) experienced far more seamless uploading of consumers because these states were proactive in not fighting the federal government at every stage thus requiring the federal exchange for 36 states. So, when many millions go online, you then get surprised not at the fact that millions need healthcare, but that some computer programmers weren’t at the top of their game? It just strikes me as pathetic that this magically becomes a “failure” to you. I believe we are at day 7, you are rather impatient when I think you are rather desperate. Its here, its permanent and your notion of fairness for the health and security of America has died permanently. Only complaints about websites remain. Really, I expected more of you.

      • Peg

        Please, Frank. This is but one of a multitude of issues with ACA. “Only complaints about websites remain”?? Seriously?

        Guess you haven’t been reading the thousands of complaints from people that cost is going up astronomically ….or that they can NOT “keep their same health plan” – or doctor – as was promised. Or that many are going to pay the penalty rather than pay the higher costs.

        If this were a private company producing such a clown show, then we’d all be laughing our heads off as we watch them disappear down the toilet bowl. But because it’s the government – with the administration you love – you find excuse after excuse.

        You are correct that it may be around for a while. It’s difficult for the host to rid itself of an intruder immediately – especially when a fascist government is at work. But I know it won’t be around for a long time to come – as it is simply going collapse due to the insane structuring of the whole plan. As Glenn Reynolds repeatedly says: “That which cannot continue will not.” And this – if you believe in math and logic – cannot.

        What is up for grabs is what comes in its place. Are we going to go whole hog socialism with single payer? Or – will we finally come to our senses and do something akin to what Switzerland has – or something else that corrects some of the definite flaws in our current (previous?) health system that need overhauling?

  7. ChillKitty

    Hey, FF, it really makes no difference if Jon Stewart wants an even more liberal policy–he felt compelled to ask Sibelius a legitimate criticism he has heard. Stewart is not a journalist, but a comedian who fancies himself a humorist along the lines of Will Rogers. With Stewart, it’s sometimes “clown nose on” and other times “clown nose off.” When he feels the heat, it’s “clown nose on.”

    Sibelius was disingenuous when she said the people logging on to the site were “shopping” in the exchanges; that would imply a choice in the marketplace. Big government has already determined that individuals have to buy their Frankenstein-product. The mere differences in gold, silver, and bronze plans are inconsequential.

    • Anonymous

      Be fair. He hasn’t received the talking points yet.

    • FF

      Have you been onto the Connecticut exchange? 9 plans available with information on subsidies, deductables and copays. that’s not shopping? New York, California, Maryland, Kentucky, Arkansas, same thing. Stewart asked a reasonable question, but it wasn’t complaints about Obamacare, it was a complaint that those with lobbyists get more than the individual. I suspect you can ask the Brothers Koch if this is true or not on the right.

  8. Peg

    I wonder if Stewart is going to report on this: now we have armed guards keeping national parks SAFE from senior citizens viewing them! Thank GOD we have Obama in the Oval Office, protecting us!

    http://www.eagletribune.com/local/x1442580353/Gestapo-tactics-meet-senior-citizens-at-Yellowstone

  9. Anonymous

    Oh look, the “personal” data for Fudrucker’s favorite law can be shared with “appropriate authorities,” for law enforcement, audit, and other activities.

    Obamacare, isn’t that special.

    http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/obamacare-marketplace-personal-data-can-be-used-law-enforcement-and-audit-activities_762237.html

  10. Dollar Bill

    FF’s valiant and single-handed swatting away of these empty-headed objections to Obamacare just illustrates the point Andrew Sullivan made the other day about the unthinking opposition of Teabaggers to health care reform. He wrote:

    “They never address the real problem of our massively inefficient private healthcare market, which is a huge burden on the economy. They never address how to help the millions of uninsured adults get the care all human beings need. They appear to regard a Heritage Foundation, free-market-designed, private healthcare exchange system as some kind of communist plot. They do not seem to believe there is any pressing problem at all. And they have nothing constructive to offer.

    This is not about Obamacare. It is not even about politics. It is about a form of revolt against the very country they live in.”

    Sullivan is right, of course. It amazes me these mutants have the gall to fashion themselves as patriots. Keep up the good work, FF.

  11. Anonymous

    Cheerleaders for National Socialism: Francis Fudrucker and Dollar Bill

  12. Cos Cobber

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303492504579111803995975562.html?mod=WSJ_hps_sections_yourmoney

    With our top rate back to 39.6%, the medicare tax at .9% and most state’s requiring and income tax in the 5% to 12% range, does the Democratic party really think we are under taxed as a nation? In addition to the above, locally most people have sales taxes of 5 to 8% and local property taxes which typically run 1% to 3% of real estate value. Oh, and there is the new net investment tax at 3.8% of investment income for Obamacare. After the next Democrat Pres closes out the Capital Gains rates, will there really be headroom to expand taxes further?

    • You have to start with the understanding that, to Democrats, 100% of all earnings belong to the government. After that, yes it’s easy to see why they think a total tax burden of 75% is too low – I believe Krugman was calling for a return of the 95% rate of the the 1950s a few months back. The difference between then and now is that no one paid that 95% rate – they will this time around.

      • Cos Cobber

        Well if it gets really ugly 20 years from now I guess my family can move to Asia. Someplace, anyplace, where labor is given more respect. Its a bit discouraging to work the late nights, the weekends and to make all the sacrifices and find your share of the deal is around 55%. While not far apart, 60/40 seems so much more fair.

        While FF and DB did a fair job running this thread around the barn yard, we never got an acknowledgement that Obama’s select enforcement of his own healthcare legislation is patently unfair.

        • Walt

          CC – That all depends on how you define fairness. To those of us who believe in the Constitution, who believe in the founding principles this country was founded on, and believe they are still relevant, it is unfair.

          To those who believe the Constitution is an archaic racist document, this is totally fair. It is income redistribution. The goal being all people are the same, and all people, no matter what their capabilities, contributions, or beliefs, are all the same. Giving everyone the opportunity to succeed is not good enough. Everyone has the same skillset, the same ability, and all are ENTITLED to free stuff. Success needs to be taxed to take care of those who don’t contribute. That is what they consider fair.

          Is this a philosophy which defines all of the laws of nature? Absolutely. Is this a philosophy which is economically impossible and with a 100% certainty of ultimately failing? Absolutely. Is this a philosophy which will stunt economic growth, and stifle creativity and exceptionalism? Absolutely.

          It is chasing Unicorns. But it sells well to the uneducated, uninspired base which keeps the progressives in power. So it is very powerful, and has mass appeal.

          So unfortunately, real fairness is not even remotely a part of the progressive equation. I wish it was. Because their solution is an economic unicorn.

        • Cos Cobber

          I don’t disagree with you at all Walt….

          …but I am centrist at heart, looking to make a deal and so I really have a serious question, after they close the capital gains rates the dems will have all the tax revenue streams they have argued for since 1986. So then what?

          And for me personally, when you move past a 60/40 split on income with uncle sam and the state, its becomes seriously “unfair.”

      • Inagua

        “The difference between then and now is that no one paid that 95% rate – they will this time around.”

        Probably not, Chris. Most high earners incorporated themselves and paid tax at the then 48% corporate rate. No reason why the same tactic won’t work again. And I think the corporate rate is now only 35%. Look for a sharp increase in “personal service corporations” if personal income tax rates go up.

      • towny

        Generaly speaking, the 1950s tax rates, would require the 47% who do not currently pay income taxes to pony up